Thursday, March 17, 2005

Religion, and the Separation of Church and State...

It is important to remember that it has always been debated. Yet not in the atheistic or pagan sense in which religion is to be extirpated from public life for forms of atheistic or pagan Nature based belief systems to take its place.

Some of the religious rationales on the side of separation,
". . . .Backus and other Baptist leaders agreed with their clerical adversaries in believing that religion was necessary for social prosperity and happiness but they believed that the best way for the state to assure the health of religion was to leave it alone and let it take its own course, which, the Baptists were convinced, would result in vital, evangelical religion covering the land."cf. The Library of Congress

It's debatable whether he was right. It ought to be noted that Christianity contains within it the notion of separation based on religious rationales, including freedom of Conscience. In contrast, there is no space for free-will and freedom of Conscience in Naturalism.

Virtually none of the Founders or anyone in American culture at the time that the founding documents were written would agree with the sort of advocacy that comes from the ACLU, an advocacy that is supposedly based on such documents. Their type of advocacy is typically for separation for the sake of socialist extirpation.And after all, the ACLU was founded by Communists, as I recall.

This is the socialist attitude toward religion:
"We want to sweep away everything that claims to be supernatural or superhuman, for the root of all untruth and lying is the pretension of the human and the natural to be superhuman and supernatural. For that reason we have once and for all declared war on religion and religious ideas . . . "
(Marx and Engels, Collected Works, Vol. 6, :103)

"It is often suggested that we have no ethics of our own; very often the bourgeoisie accuse us Communists of rejecting all morality. This is a method of confusing the issue, of throwing dust in the eyes of workers and peasants.In what sense do we reject ethics, reject morality? In the sense given to it by the bourgeoisie, who based ethics on God's commandments. On this point we, of course, say that we do not believe in God. . . .We reject any morality based on extra-human and extra-class concepts."
(Lenin, Collected Works, vol. 31, p. 291)

"Every religious idea, every idea of God, even flirting with the idea of God, is unutterable vileness . . . .vileness of themost dangerous kind, 'contagion' of the most abominable kind. Millions of sins, filthy deeds, acts of violence and physical contagions . . . are far less dangerousthan the subtle, spiritual idea of a God . . ."
(Lenin, Collected Works, vol. 15, p. 402)

"We must combat religion, that is the ABC of . . . Marxism." --Lenin

"The first requisite for the happiness of the people is the abolition of religion." --Marx